Dodge, Hamilton And Pistols

[Larry Koschkee]

What was all the fuss about? Why did Dodge, forever the irritable southern gentleman, challenge fellow militiamen, Col. William S. Hamilton to a duel?

In Crawford Thayer's book Hunting A Shadow, pp 58 - 60 there is a cluster of references suggesting strained relations between Dodge and Hamilton. The time frame of the episode took place on or about June 30th, 1832 at the time some Illinois militia units were asked to vote for a leader, Brigadier General Alexander Posey or Col. Henry Dodge. Following are two of the most poignant references.

1) The Colonel, at my thrice repeated request, stopped his horse (Big Black) and, as Hamilton approached, sprang off, and presented Hamilton with the butt ends of his two pistols, and entreated him to take choice, that the question might be settled there and then which was to be commander. Hamilton at once threw up both hands, and sitting down on the hill-side declined to fight.

2) Colonel Hamilton came up and spoke to the General, who threw his leg over his horse, and drawing out his two pistols and marching up to Hamilton, offered him the butt ends of his pistols, saying, "Take your choice, sir, take your choice", and advancing all the time as Hamilton walked back and holding up his hands said, "General, I do not want to fight."
"The General then said, Damn you, obey my orders hereafter, and then jumped on his splendid horse (Big Black), and we rode up to the encampment of General posey's Brigade and to the Geeneral/s head quarters.

Whew! Is this an excellent case of "conflict resolution" or was Old Dodge in need of "anger management" thearpy? (You do not have to respond to that)

Larry K.

[Robert Braun]

I have always been curious about the Dodge/Hamilton challenge, primarily because dueling propensities apparently were the exception for Dodge, not the rule.

I have only found one other instance where Dodge was involved in a duel. In Missouri. Dodge and John Scott acted as seconds in the Thomas H. Crittenton / Dr. Walter Fenwick Duel. This duel took place on October 1, 1811 on Moreau’s Island, a sandbar located a few miles south of Ste. Genevieve.

On one hand, the Hamilton challenge was extraordinary for its coarseness. Dodge surely knew that Billy's father and eldest brother were killed in duels. (Billy himself had the knowledge that he challenged Aaron Burr to a duel in St. Louis, in revenge for Billy's father's death. Burr considered Billy's youth and his own advancing years-- and wisely declined.)

On the other hand, Dodge came to Missouri a young man and rapidly learned the "creed" of the western territories: where men of Southern extraction predominated, wearing pistols in public on a daily basis was not uncommon, and differences of opinion were often settled on the "field of honor." Dodge's early acquaintance with men like John Smith T. a wealthy, well educated land speculator and businessman (and a notorious dueler, who not only wore pistols and knives in public, but also developed a solid reputation as a crack shot and fierce pistolier-- having killed more than a dozen men in duels) may well have had at least some influence on Dodge, who likewise wore pistols in public after his sojourn to the Mineral District.

(Dodge severed his relationship with Smith T. over the Burr affair, but that didn't preclude Dodge and doubtless others in the Missouri Territory from venturing forth heavily armed as part of one's daily ritual.)

To return to the original questions, my readings indicate that Dodge was likely slow to anger...but once provoked, was formidable to say the least. Over the past year, I have changed my mind on this particular incident. I now think the Hamilton challenge was many things-- among them a stern rebuke for Hamilton disbedience of some directive issued by Dodge, and a challenge given very publically as an object lesson to those who witnessed the exchange and Hamilton's backing down. It certainly had an effect on George Wallace Jones, from whom we have the story of the Dodge challenge.

Commentators seem to agree that Dodge has a real genius for "knowing" people. If this is accurate, he knew that the emotional effect of the story of this challenge would grow and build...meaning the chances that he would be have to deal with insubordination or challenges to his authority in the future would be lessened. It was also revealing of Dodge's resolute character once fixed on a particular object. One proof of this thesis MAY be found in the fact that Dodge lost the election to Posey.

Why? Among the reasons must be that the Illinois militia KNEW that Dodge would lead them foremost into battle against the Black Hawk... a fact which I think is mentioned further on in Hunting for a Shadow. Dement's disgust for the Illinois militia at this point was so severe that he reportedly tore up his commission.

Interesting subject!

Regards, Bob.

[Larry Koschkee]

In trying to make some sense of this Dodge/Hamilton altercation I continue to focus on the words:

...that the question might be settled there and then which was to be commander.

1) Does this imply Hamilton was challenging Dodge's command of Michigan Mounted Militia?

2) Did Hamilton become aware of Atkinson's orders to place General Posey's brigade under Col. Dodge and expressed his disagreement?

3) Did Hamilton disagree with Dodge's decision to hold an election among the Illinois Militia to determine their commander going forward... Dodge or Posey?

4) Finally, was Hamilton upset that Posey's brigade chose Posey over Dodge to command the militia in the Lead District, therefore Hamilton was not going to accept orders from Posey? Is this what upset Dodge? Dodge ordered Hamilton to follow Posey's command and orders and Hamilton disobeyed?

General Posey was the new kid on the block and was now the militia commander in charge of The Lead District militia actions. (Henry Atkinson to Alexander Posey, July 16th, 1832. "You are charged with the command and defence of the Mineral District and will so dispose your force as to meet that object.")

[Robert Braun]

Unfortunately, there is much about this altercation that we do not know. My suspicion is, however, that a challenge to a duel suggests, not a personal affront to Posey, but rather a personal matter of honor between Hamilton and Dodge.

Indeed the record indicated that Dodge wanted an election-- to be clear as to the commander. He was, indeed, true to the spirit of the militia in this election of a commander, Atkinson's order notwithstanding.

General Posey in charge of the defense of the Mineral District, eh? My casual reading of Posey's command ability seems to indicate that his leadership in defending the lead mines would be akin to being on board a sinking ocean liner, and rushing to the bridge--


--only to find that the captain was Daffy Duck!



Regards, Bob.

[Larry Koschkee]

Not willing to give up on this Dodge/Hamilton curiosity I have done some more digging and scratching for a shred of material to shine some light on the subject.

William Salter's The Life Of Henry Dodge has a paragraph that speaks to the Dodge/Hamilton altercation. I am unclear of his source, perhaps it was George Wallace Jones.

At this time a feeling of resentment on the part of Col. Dodge towards Capt. W. S. Hamilton for disobedience of orders with reference to the friendly Indians was aggravated.

What can we conclude from this statement?

Also in Salter's book there is mention of the Dodge/Hamilton relationship. It was a quote from A.C. Dodge to Cyrus Woodman, July 1883.

Hamilton was one of my father's captains both in the war of '27 and 32', although they had some unpleasant difficulties, ephemeral in their nature, my brothers, sisters and myself were on excellent terms with him. He was one of the most interesting and clever of Wisconsin pioneers, and in many respects a most remarkable and meritorious man.

[Robert Braun]

Part of the explaination regarding Dodge wearing pistols during and after the BHW extends from his learnings and dealings in Missouri.

Lead, salt, and leand dealings were big business in Missouri-- particularly after the transfer of territory to America, which has the effect of voiding most land deals held by local Americans from the Spanish and the French.

Rivalries were intense-- as evidenced by the frequent feuding between factions such as those of John Smith T. and Moses Austin. Men like Smith T. generally appeared in public wearing pistols and knives. Dodge spit with the Smith T. faction over the Burr debacle, but never got out of the habit of publically wearing pistols.

Unlike Smith T. and others of the era, there is little in the record to support the notion that Dodge was a duelist. I have only found one instant of DOdge's involvement in a formal duel-- Dodge and John Scott acted as seconds in the Thomas H. Crittenton/Dr. Walter Fenwick Duel October 1, 1811 on Moreau’s Island, a sandbar located a few miles south of St. Genevieve, MIssouri.

As I may have indicated earlier, Dodge's challenge of Hamilton, while seemingly dispicable on its face (give the tragedies suffered by the Hamilton family over dueling) most likely resulted from some grave insult on Hamilton's part.

Regards, Bob.

[Larry Koschkee]

I respectively reject the notion that Dodge's challenge of Hamilton was due to an insulting statement or position by Hamilton. (Robert Braun - "most likely resulted from some grave insult on Hamilton's part.") Hamilton does not strike me as someone with the mannerisim to engage in a insulting conversation. Would he have the demeanor to challenge or question another man's actions, Dodge's actions or orders? Yes.

It is evident that Dodge and Hamilton had butted heads in the past, and maybe rightly so; ie, A.C. Dodge's statement originally cited in this thread.

Hamilton was one of my father's captains both in the war of '27 and '32, although they had some unpleasant difficulties, ephemeral in their nature...

It is apparent that Hamilton was not one of Dodge's heel hounds such as Bracken, Parkinson, Jones and others too numerous to mention here. It is also interesting to note that Hamilton and Dodge took too very different paths to success in the mining district.

Hamilton, for the most part, went at it alone... blending into the Winnebago neighborhood. Dodge on the other hand forced and threatened his way into the neighborhood, immediately fortified himself and defied the Indians and U.S. Government that called for his removal. Declared himself the man to be reckoned with or the new Bull in the Woods. Wore two pistols inserted into his belt outside his garments for all the world to see.

to be continued.....

[pshrake]

Dodge was not the only one to have problems with Hamilton. Below is a transcription of two letters. One is a pretty strong complaint from Hamilton to John Kinzie. The other from Kinzie to Secretary of War Eaton telling his side of the story. I will leave it to the reader to draw thier own conclusions on the exchange, but... Though Hamilton might not resort to insulting conversation he does seem to be capable of hot headed actions. Some similar circumstance could have fueled the Dodge/Hamilton dispute.

The source for both letters is the National Archives, Letters Recived by the Office of Indian Affairs, Winnebago Agency, Microcopy 234 Reel 931

Pete



WILLIAM S. HAMILTON TO JOHN KINZIE
Sir
Your letter [without] address was handed me a few days since by a friend of Man Eater – The guns were taken by men in my employ because the Indians had [entered] the Cabin of one of my miners and plundered it, the goods were found in possession of this Indian (Man Eater) and his [friends]. – The little faith I have in the Indian Department has compelled me to adopt a system of retaliation, and I have determined in all instances to pursue the aggressors, retake the property, and allow the persons in company with me to take property enough from the Indians to pay them for their trouble and in some instances to [use] the lash, your interference will only make the thing worse. The Indians have committed sundry depredations in this neighborhood such as steeling horses – If proper [exertion] was used by the Indian department these evil might be avoided but on the [contrary] rumor say that the course pursued by you at the portage has had a tendency to increase instead of diminishing the [sort] if true as told me, you may [expect] to hear from Washington.
Yours with much respect
Nov 14, 1830 W.S. Hamilton


KINZIE TO SECRETARY OF WAR JOHN EATON
Fort Winnebago, Dec 5th 1830
John H Eaton,
Secty of War
Washington City
Sir,
In consequence of a letter received by me yesterday from a Mr. William S. Hamilton, of the Lead Mines, within this Territory, and from information received through other sources, attaching blame to me in my official capacity of Sub agent of Indian Affairs, at this place, during the payment of annuities to the Winnebagoes – I feel it a duty which I owe to myself and the Department to lay before you such facts as my enable you to judge of the course pursued by me, in the discharge of those duties. I am inclined to believe, both from the letter of Mr. Hamilton, and from other persons, that unfavorable representations have been made to your office, respecting my official conduct.
In all that I have done, I have made it a point to be guided strictly by the instructions received from the War Department, and from His Excellency Gov. Cass to whose Superintendency I am attached. In the payment of the Annuity, the “Circular” from the War Dept. of 16th Feb, and the instructions to Gov. Cass, of 18th June last, (a copy of which His Excellency sent to me,) have been carefully followed by me and to away even suspicion, the military officers of this post, with several other gentlemen, at my request, attended, and aided me in counting and paying it out, and witnessed the receipts.
The principal cause of dissatisfaction among these people is 1st, they are displeased, because the money for the Indians in that vicinity was not paid out to them in their neighborhood, where they could have a good opportunity of selling to those Indians, liquor in any quantity – 2nd Because I did not pay out of the annuity money, claims innumerable, presented by them against the Winnebagoes, nine-tenths of which were not duly authenticated, and charging far beyond the vale of the property, said to have been taken. Several claims were acknowledged and paid by the Indians, and I was requested by them in council “not to pay any claim against them, as they believed the white people wanted to cheat them out of all their money; but to send the claims to Washington for their Great Father to see and if he considered them just, that they would pay them.” I have accordingly forwarded to the War Department, through Gov. Cass, several claims against the Winnebagoes. Some of the claimants would not give me their claims to send as they were very much dissatisfied with my instructions and with me for not deducting the amounts from the annuity forthwith. It is these men who are making all these disturbances, and who must blame themselves for any injury done to them by the Indians. If they would use economy in the distribution of whiskey, less mischief would be done; and I feel confident that more depredations are complained of, than are actually committed. The people of the interior of the Mines, (at Dodgeville, Blue Mounds. &c), say that they have had no trouble with the Indians in their vicinity – that they are very orderly – much more so, than many of the whites. All these dissensions, between the Indians and the miners, are on the boarders of the Indian line, where are scattered 8 to 10 huts, inhabited by persons, many of whom are regardless of honesty and ready for any adventure.
Most of the robberies committed by the Indians, can be traced to one [source]- ardent spirits, that instrument of destruction which and, at any time be obtained for a mere trifle from those persons who are little better than savages themselves. I have had frequent complaints made to me from the Indians of that section of country, who have been robbed in turn by whites – and their not being able to give the names of the persons by whom they were thus robbed, has prevented me from recovering as much stolen property, as I otherwise might have done. When at Rock river, the other day, the Man Eater, principal & head chief of the Rock river Indians, came and made complaint, that an American had robbed him of two guns, and he would be glad to have me write to him to deliver them up, as he was about to go, and make his winter’s hunt. I asked if he knew the man’s name he answered “no,” but if I would give him a paper, he would take it in person, to the man who robbed him. I accordingly wrote the person a polite note, requesting if he had the guns, that “he would deliver them up, and this confer a favour on both myself and the Indian.” The answer to this note, is the letter of Mr. Hamilton, referred to, which I have the honor to transmit for your perusal. It will show you the spirit by which some of the whites are actuated in making reprisals upon the Indians, and which, if not stopped, may lead to serious consequences.
I have the honor, to be,
With much respect, Sir,
Yo. Obt. Sevt.
Jno. H Kinzie
Sub Agt. Ind. Affs.

[Larry Koschkee]

It appears Hamilton was applying some old fashioned frontier justice. At any rate you are correct, Pete let the reader decide. One can look at Hamilton's action as "hot-headed" or cool and calculated retaliation.

Warm regards,

Larry

[Robert Braun]

Larry said:

I respectively reject the notion that Dodge's challenge of Hamilton was due to an insulting statement or position by Hamilton. (Robert Braun - "most likely resulted from some grave insult on Hamilton's part.") Hamilton does not strike me as someone with the mannerisim to engage in a insulting conversation. Would he have the demeanor to challenge or question another man's actions, Dodge's actions or orders? Yes.

It is evident that Dodge and Hamilton had butted heads in the past, and maybe rightly so; ie, A.C. Dodge's statement originally cited in this thread.

Hamilton was one of my father's captains both in the war of '27 and '32, although they had some unpleasant difficulties, ephemeral in their nature...

It is apparent that Hamilton was not one of Dodge's heel hounds such as Bracken, Parkinson, Jones and others too numerous to mention here. It is also interesting to note that Hamilton and Dodge took too very different paths to success in the mining district.

Hamilton, for the most part, went at it alone... blending into the Winnebago neighborhood. Dodge on the other hand forced and threatened his way into the neighborhood, immediately fortified himself and defied the Indians and U.S. Government that called for his removal. Declared himself the man to be reckoned with or the new Bull in the Woods. Wore two pistols inserted into his belt outside his garments for all the world to see.

to be continued.....

I believe we've plowed some of this same ground before...

1. I recall that "Heel Hound" George Jones brought us the story of the Dodge/Hamilton dispute and challenge. Dodge's "Damn you..." comment seems to indicate a transgression or misunderstanding on Hamilton's part. Further, the latter's submissive behavior may futher indicate (among other things) his admission of the transgression.

2. I recall that Hamilton had companions when he staked his claim... Elisha Shook and William Haws. There must have been others, as I rather doubt three men raised the qualities of galena later ascribed to "Hamilton's Diggings." So... are you saying that Hamilton's excursion to supposed Winnebago country was legal, while Dodge's expedition was not?

3. We find no evidence that Dodge bullied anyone to obtain local Winnebago permission to excavate lead at "Dodge's Camp"-- he followed the clear precidents set by the Federal authorities for the Gratiot brothers, and later Brigham, Parish, and apparently Hamilton himself. There is no evidence from the written correspondence that he bullied the U. S. agents who visited his diggings with the concerns of their superiors. Nor does there appear to be evidence that Dodge's now infamous "whip all the sore shinned regulars" comment was ever publically stated or publically communicated, despite some modern interpretations to the cointrary (i. e. "Rush for Grey Gold.")

4. I don't know whether or not Hamilton fortified his cabin. I do know that Dodge wasn't the only one to fortify his, prior to the BHW.

5. I again submit that Dodge's wearing of pistols was not uncommon given his experiences in Missouri, and further postulate that, given the accounts of pistols worn by backwoodsmen and "frontier types" in the west, and in places like future Kansas and Sante Fe, that the wearing of pistols in public was probably not an uncommon practice in the Lead Region, generally.

Kind regards,

Bob.

[Larry Koschkee]

When one looks at the role Hamilton played in the BH, you see a direct correlation between Indian Agents and Hamilton. The Winnebagoes affectionately called him tee-wa-ank (Little Man) or tee-huunk (Little Chief). While researching White and Indian relations in the mining district, I have not come across one disperaging word about Hamilton.

Hamilton's good relations with the Indians were recognized by General Atkinson. On two different occassions Atkinson issued orders to Hamilton to recruit and command Indian volunteers. In addition, Hamilton commanded a spy or scout company under General Dodge consisting of about twenty Mississippi River Menomonie Indians and eight or ten white militia men. Therefore, it is understandable, when taking Hamilton's Indian relations, and contrast that with Dodge's Indian relations in the years 1827 - 1832, there would be friction between the two men.

In the 1827 Winnebago War Dodge endangered the frontier by running rough shod over the Winnebago factions that had no association or connection with Red Bird and followers. Dodge repeated this active aggression and humiliation towards the Winnebago in the Michigan Territory during the BH.

I accept full responsibility for the following opinion as it is mine alone and not the express opinion of this message board and its moderators.

My answer to why Dodge offered Hamilton a choice of pistols has its basis found in the George Wallace Jones' quotes as previously stated in this thread - and that is:

1) At this time a feeling of resentment on the part of Col. Dodge towards Capt. W. W. Hamilton for disobedience of orders with reference to the friendly Indians was aggravated.

2) that the question might be settled there and then which was to be commander

As mentioned previously Atkinson instructed Hamilton to proceed to Prairie du Chien and with the help of the two agents there, Joseph Street and John Marsh, raise a volunteer company of Sioux, Winnebago and Menomonie Indians. Atkinson had learned there were a couple hundred Menomonies there, however they had returned to Green Bay prior to the arrival of Hamilton.

Hamilton was successful in raising about 170 Sioux, Winnebago and Menomonie warriors from the upper Mississippi River region. This is the volunteer company that showed up an hour after the Battle of the Pecatonica on June 16th. Waukon Decorah's Winnebago Wisconsin River band joined the company at Hamilton's Fort later on the 16th swelling the company ranks to more than 200 warriors.

On June 17th, Dodge, Hamilton, John Marsh and Henry Gratiot met with the leaders of the three Indian bands to go over the next military strategies. Dodge took command of the greatest part of Hamilton's 200 plus company, leaving Hamilton with "the Winnibagoes from Prairie Le Cross."

Dodge's companies were to eventually meet Atkinson's Army on the Rock River, but were not prepared. They needed more horses. Dodge wanted to insert the Indian company into the mining district to buy time for the militia to resupply horses. This strategy back fired on Old Dodge. When the Sioux learned Hamilton was no longer commander they became concerned. They claimed they were recruited by the Indian Agents to be spies and flankers. "They were not to be put to hard fighting." The Sioux rejected Dodge's leadership for the same reason General Posey's militia did on June 30th... They did not want a leader with reckless characteristics that may put them in harms way unnecessarily.

The Mississippi and Wisconsin River Winnebago bands left with the Sioux, leaving only a few Mississippi River Menomonie that eventually fell under the command of Hamilton.

[Robert Braun]

AMBUSHED eh?

Hmm... NEXT time I'll wait for the entire posting before I decide to respond!

I'm confused here. You are equating "concerns" with Dodge's alleged command of Hamilton's Indian company with "concerns" expressed by Posey's command. One was a company command; the other arguably was brigade command. Clearly, he knew the difference (having commanded both at different times during the War of 1812.)

I do not understand why Dodge would assume command of a "company" directly, then at the same time seek to command a brigade as well. It doesn't make sense, and is inconsistant with Dodge military assignments and command levels up to the date and incidents in question.

Finally, we really need to adress this continual charge of "recklessness." If Dodge was 'reckless' during the Winnebago War of 1827, where there was no fighting and Dodge reportedly saved from needless shooting the fifteen-year-old son of Chief Winneshiek, I would like to learn about the facts that point to that conclusion. If Dodge was 'reckless' towards the Winnebago during the BHW, I would likewise like to learn the instances and facts that point to that conclusion as well.

Kind regards, Bob.

[pshrake]

All right, I know this is off the subject but I just have to bite…

Bob wrote;

“Finally, we really need to adress this continual charge of "recklessness." If Dodge was 'reckless' during the Winnebago War of 1827, where there was no fighting and Dodge reportedly saved from needless shooting the fifteen-year-old son of Chief Winneshiek, I would like to learn about the facts that point to that conclusion.”


To start with, we should be clear. The controversy regarding Dodge in 1827 does not involve his movements during the actual uprising but rather in the tense months that followed. The uprising took place from July 26 to September 2. Dodge was actively engaged leading several companies of mounted militia out of the Galena area and accompanying General Atkinson up the Wisconsin River to the portage. Apparently it was while he was on this expedition with Atkinson he discovered the incredible deposits of lead around what is now Dodgeville.

While at the portage, in September, Dodge was present at a council held between chiefs and headmen of the tribe and General Atkinson. The leaders of the Ho-Chunk Nation agreed not to molest or harm any trespasser on to their lands until the following summer when a council would be held to address the grievances of the Ho-Chunk.

By November 3, within two months of Red Bird’s surrender, he had already constructed a smelter. His operations were clearly deep into Ho-Chunk territory far beyond the vague boundary line that separated Ho-Chunk land from the collective “Illinois tribes” as established in the Treaty of 1825. Indian agent Joseph Street, in a letter to Lawrence Taliaferro on January 27, 1828, recorded the complaints of several chiefs who “did not expect this” kind of action and wanted the miners removed.

It was clear to many that the Ho-Chunk were still smarting from the events of that summer. “Talks” held with the chiefs noted the growing frustration of the tribe, which combined with excessive drinking made for testy, potentially volatile, Indians.

Now, it must be conceded that the Treaty of Green Bay signed in August 1828 and the subsequent Treaty of 1829 at Prairie du Chien legalized Dodges actions….but only after the fact.

Add to this the well established fact that Dodge was operating with a sizeable group of miners, in a fortified site, with walls of guns in his cabin. All of which meant Dodge was expecting trouble, but with who? Would he have actually fought a detachment of soldiers? Was he fending off other miners? Or was he expecting trouble from the Indians? Chances are, because the Ho-Chunk were still upset because of the uprising, he was expecting trouble from the Ho-Chunk. Why would he expect trouble from the very Indians from which he claimed to have legally purchased the land?

I still maintain he had no legal right to buy land from the Indians and I have some trouble with Bob's comment that Dodge;

"followed the clear precidents set by the Federal authorities for the Gratiot brothers, and later Brigham, Parish, and apparently Hamilton himself."

I find equal fault with Hamilton and others for entering into Ho-Chunk land, but I would love to see the "precidents set by the federal authorities" regarding the private purchase of Indian land. I have yet to find any federal official who would on record condone such actions. In fact there was a considerable federal law and policy prohibiting such purchase from taking place.


I do not have a problem with the fact that Dodge was an opportunist and took a chance, and I agree that he is often unjustly vilified or at least misunderstood. But at the same time one can not say the man did no wrong, ever, at any time, under any circumstance.

In regards to the events of 1827-28 I have always said and will continue to say, it is a matter of timing. In the fall of 1827, he recklessly disregarded the state of affairs on the frontier and went into a region he had no business going into. His actions could have very easily ignited a second uprising among the Ho-Chunk. The fact that it did not, and the fact that his actions were, in effect, legalized almost a year later does not absolve him.

But like I said before...I digress from the discussion at hand.

Pete

[Robert Braun]

pshrake said:

All right, I know this is off the subject but I just have to bite…

Bob wrote;

“Finally, we really need to adress this continual charge of "recklessness." If Dodge was 'reckless' during the Winnebago War of 1827, where there was no fighting and Dodge reportedly saved from needless shooting the fifteen-year-old son of Chief Winneshiek, I would like to learn about the facts that point to that conclusion.”


To start with, we should be clear. The controversy regarding Dodge in 1827 does not involve his movements during the actual uprising but rather in the tense months that followed. The uprising took place from July 26 to September 2. Dodge was actively engaged leading several companies of mounted militia out of the Galena area and accompanying General Atkinson up the Wisconsin River to the portage. Apparently it was while he was on this expedition with Atkinson he discovered the incredible deposits of lead around what is now Dodgeville.

While at the portage, in September, Dodge was present at a council held between chiefs and headmen of the tribe and General Atkinson. The leaders of the Ho-Chunk Nation agreed not to molest or harm any trespasser on to their lands until the following summer when a council would be held to address the grievances of the Ho-Chunk.

By November 3, within two months of Red Bird’s surrender, he had already constructed a smelter. His operations were clearly deep into Ho-Chunk territory far beyond the vague boundary line that separated Ho-Chunk land from the collective “Illinois tribes” as established in the Treaty of 1825. Indian agent Joseph Street, in a letter to Lawrence Taliaferro on January 27, 1828, recorded the complaints of several chiefs who “did not expect this” kind of action and wanted the miners removed.

It was clear to many that the Ho-Chunk were still smarting from the events of that summer. “Talks” held with the chiefs noted the growing frustration of the tribe, which combined with excessive drinking made for testy, potentially volatile, Indians.

Now, it must be conceded that the Treaty of Green Bay signed in August 1828 and the subsequent Treaty of 1829 at Prairie du Chien legalized Dodges actions….but only after the fact.

Add to this the well established fact that Dodge was operating with a sizeable group of miners, in a fortified site, with walls of guns in his cabin. All of which meant Dodge was expecting trouble, but with who? Would he have actually fought a detachment of soldiers? Was he fending off other miners? Or was he expecting trouble from the Indians? Chances are, because the Ho-Chunk were still upset because of the uprising, he was expecting trouble from the Ho-Chunk. Why would he expect trouble from the very Indians from which he claimed to have legally purchased the land?

I still maintain he had no legal right to buy land from the Indians and I have some trouble with Bob's comment that Dodge;

"followed the clear precidents set by the Federal authorities for the Gratiot brothers, and later Brigham, Parish, and apparently Hamilton himself."

I find equal fault with Hamilton and others for entering into Ho-Chunk land, but I would love to see the "precidents set by the federal authorities" regarding the private purchase of Indian land. I have yet to find any federal official who would on record condone such actions. In fact there was a considerable federal law and policy prohibiting such purchase from taking place.


I do not have a problem with the fact that Dodge was an opportunist and took a chance, and I agree that he is often unjustly vilified or at least misunderstood. But at the same time one can not say the man did no wrong, ever, at any time, under any circumstance.

In regards to the events of 1827-28 I have always said and will continue to say, it is a matter of timing. In the fall of 1827, he recklessly disregarded the state of affairs on the frontier and went into a region he had no business going into. His actions could have very easily ignited a second uprising among the Ho-Chunk. The fact that it did not, and the fact that his actions were, in effect, legalized almost a year later does not absolve him.

But like I said before...I digress from the discussion at hand.

Pete

Pete makes some very good points and raises many important questions.

One clarification-- accounts indicated that Dodge didn't purchase the lead land from the Winnebago. Rather, he leased the land from the Bear in exchange for a quantity of goods and supplies. The Gratiots did this as well, and much earlier in the history of the region. I suspect, but don't know for certain, that Brigham, Parish and doubltess others did the same.

I have made the observation in other threads that the Federal Government agents knew of these transactions, and did little to stop them-- Dodge being the lone exception, as far as we can determine. I maintain that the government's indifference or inability to enforce established treaty agreements and treaty law CHANGED the de facto nature of treaty law in the Mineral District. It makes no sense to allow say Billy Hamilton to establish himself with a 1,000 acre claim across the boundary (whereever it might be) just because "we like him" and then go after Dodge and his established claim just because "we don't like him" or "we can make of him an example."

I submit that Dodge was well-familiar with Indian tensions from his past and present life, and was not going to take chances with the protection of his large family. (Notice that it was his home that was fortified, and not necessarily a "fort" for the general protection diggers in the locale.) I suspect Parish and probably others did the same.

We have strayed a bit, but your points are most interesting!

Kind regards,

Bob

[Larry Koschkee]

I regret that I have not responded to Pete and Bob's latest posting until now to keep the dialog moving and fresh. Too many airplane schedules delayed due to snow conditions. Santa Claus' mode of transportation, reindeer and sleigh, would have been a better choice of transportation.

Talking Points

1) Bob said: " I recall that "Heel Hound" George Jones brought us the story of the Dodge/Hamilton dispute and challenge. Dodge's "Damn you..." comment seems to indicate a transgression or misunderstanding on Hamilton's part. Further, the latter's submissive behavior may further indicate (among other things) his admission of the transgression."

-- Transgression? Yes - Dodge said "...Damn you, obey my orders hereafter..." Misunderstanding? No - I can not find a basis for that interpretation. Submissive behavior? - Admission of the transgression? I concede that Hamilton backed away from Dodge's challenge, but not for the reason of "admission of the transgression." We can only speculate on his reason. On this note, I believe we give Dodge way too much credit when one states "Commentators seem to agree that Dodge has a real genius for "knowing" people." I am suspicious of that contention because it came from a lone source... one of Dodge's "heel hounds", Peter Parkinson, Jr. Parkinson was clearly enamored with Dodge.

2) Bob said: "So... are you saying that Hamilton's excursion to supposed Winnebago country was legal, while Dodge's expedition was not?" I have stated my position on this subject previously in another thread. All of the squatters and miners were trespassing on Winnebago treatied land. I am not singling out Dodge... they all should have been physically removed by force with government troops at the end of a gun barrel. I believe this puts this position in Pete Shrakes camp because trespassing on Winnebago land as recognized by the U. S. Government and Indian Tribes signatory to the Treaty of 1825 was illegal.

In addition, the trespassers were in violation of the terms and conditions of the "Five Leagues Square" that has its basis in the Treaty of 1804. That treaty with the Sac and Fox stipulated a federal land reserve "three leagues square" at the confluence of the Wisconsin and Mississippi River to be established on land north or south of the Wisconsin River. The treaties of 1816 with individual tribes stipulated an additional federal reserve.

"...except three leagues square at the mouth of the Quisconsing river, including both banks, and such other tracts, on or near to the Quisconsing and Mississippi rivers as the president of the United States may think proper to reserve; Provided, that such other tracts shall not in the whole exceed the quanity would be contained in five leagues square."

Well the President of the U.S. decided the "five leagues square" shall be located at or near the confluence of the Fever and Mississippi rivers. Imagine that! Contrary to popular belief the land reserve dimensions were not perfectly squared which perpetrated much confusion on the frontier.

The Winnebago considered the northern boundary line of the land reserve to be on and south of "The Ridge."
Several accounts show U.S. mining district agents warning miners not to cross the "Ridge."

3) Bob said: "There is no evidence from the written correspondence that he bullied the U. S. agents who visited his diggings with the concerns of their superiors. Nor does there appear to be evidence that Dodge's now infamous "whip all the sore shinned regulars" comment was ever publicately stated or publically communicated, despite some modern interpretations to the contrary (i.e. "Rush for Grey Gold.")

I concede that Dodge did not bully the U.S. Agents but you must agree Dodge defied Joseph Street and ignored his cease and desist order to remove from Winnebago land. A great example of Dodge's defiance is a quote from Peter Parkinson, Jr. "reasonably obscure biography on Henry Dodge..." --- The words of Dodge that he could "lick all the sore-shinned Regulars at Prairie du Chien."

-- to be continued --