Black Hawk & Jim Thorpe.

[Robert Braun]

It's a compelling story laced with dramatic irony... Black Hawk is released from his chains at Jefferson Barracks, and goes on a tour of America's great eastern cities. There, the local press laud him and his son Whirling Thunder. Then, years later, Whirling Thunder has a son whose Christian name is James Francis Thorpe-- the legendary Jim Thorpe, the Sauk world-class athlete proclaimed the "All American."

Northern Illinois University proclaims this lineage on its website. The History Channel program "Black Hawk's War" concludes with this dramatic story. In fact, this lineal connectivity between Black Hawk and Jim Thorpe is so dang cool that hardly anyone questioned it!

...until now....

Read all about it on the Old Lead Region Historical Society's "Oops Page" www.geocities.com/old_lead/oops.htm

[Jeffrey]

I did a cursory inspection of the internet and there are indeed a lot of sites that claim a relation between Black Hawk and Jim Thorpe. I happen to have in my possession some of Cecil Eby's correspondence regarding "That Disgraceful Affair." In an old file from the 1970s, there is a two page document that I will reproduce here for anyone interested. It's a weathered xerox and its only claim for authenticity is that it is as you can see detailed. I will preserve the original punctuation and capitalization:
BLACK HAWK'S DESCENDANTS
MUK-A-TA-QUET BORN 1580-1600
CHILDREN
1. NA-NA-KEE (THUNDER) BORN VINCINITY MONTREAL
2. NA-MAH (STURGEON)
3. PAU-KA-HUM-MA-WA

NA-NA-KEE'S SON
PY-E-SA DIED 1786-87 WIFE HALF FRENCH
SON

ME-KA-TIA-ME-SHE-KIA-KIAK (BLACK HAWK) 1767/10-3-1838
WIFE AS-SHE-WE-QUA (SINGING BIRD`MOTHER HALF FRENCH)
BORN 1761`8-29-1846 KANSAS
1. OLDEST SON DIED CHILD
2. YOUNGEST DAUGHTER DIED CHILD
3. NEXT OLDEST LIVING SON NA-SHE-ASK-UK BORN 1805-09 ?
4. YOUNGEST SON WA-SAW-ME-SAW DIED 1851-1852? KANSAS
5. DAUGHER NA-ME-QUA DIED 1880-1890`OKLAHOMA RESERVATION

CHILDREN OF NA-SHE-ASK-UK
1. PAHSHEPAWHO KAKAQUE (LOGAN) 1822-1832
2. SHAWANAKWA (MALE)
3. BAHETHA (MALE)
4. HAKIKIWATAKA (JOSEPH) DIED CHILD
5. KWAMIA (FEMALE)

PAHSHEPAWHO KAKAQUE (LOGAN) MARRIED WA SAW ME SAW (ELLEN)
(LOGAN'S WIFE SAC WOMEN PART WHITE- FATHER FRENCH TRADER)
CHILDREN OF ELLEN AND (LOGAN)
1. SHAWANAKWAKA (MALE)
2. THAWANAKOSKANO (ESTER`INEZ) DIED 10-5-1945
3. THAKITOA (JESSIE) BORN 1875-76
4. NAKOTWYTUCK (WALTER) 1882`3-10-1909
5. THATHAKAA (FEMALE)

THIRD CHILD, SECOND SON DIED IN INFANCY

THAKITOA (JESSIE) MARRIED 3 TIMES
WIFE 1. UNKNOWN
WIFE 2. WISHENOX (MINNIE POWERS) POTTAWATOMIE DIV. 1918
WIFE 3. CLARA (BENSON) (MCCULLEN)

1. NA-SH-QUMA (HAIL`MARY`MAUD) BORN 1898
(second page)
NAHKOTWYTUCK (WALTER0 MARRIED AHNOMWAHTUM (DEBRA)
CHILDREN OF WALTER AND DEBRA
NONE` NO NATURAL CHILDEREN (sic)-RAISED WIFE'S CHILDREN FROM FIRST MARRIAGE TO MR. DAVIS

1. JUNITA DAVIS BORN 1893
2. SADIE DAVIS BORN 1902` MARRIED MR. TYNER`SON RALPH DAVIS
OTHER HUSBANDS AND ILLIGENTIMENT (sic) CHILDREN

ESTER KAKAQU MARRIED JACKSON WAKOLE AND MR. MCCULLEN
CHILDREN

1. GEORGE MCCULLEN
2. ELIZA MCCULLEN
3. HORCE MCCULLEN
4. MARIE MCCULLEN
5. EGAR MCCULLEN
6. RICHARD WAKOLE
7. GLADE WAKOLE
8. GRACE WAKOLE

GRANDCHILDREN DAVID AND WILLIAM PIQUANNA

NA-SE-QUMA (MARY- MAUD) MARRIED TWICE
HUSBAND 1. CURTIS PIQUANNA DIV. 1932
HUSBAND 2. EDWARD MACK

CHILDREN

1. FORREST DIED 1 YEAR OLD
2. RENA DIED 1940 CHILD `SHAWNEE, OK.
3. CAROL

CAROL MACK MARRIED MR. PATTERSON
CHILDREN

1. VALARIE MARRIED MR. TAYLOR CHILD EDWARD BLAINE
2. O-KI-MA-TA (jESSICA DAWN) MARRIED MR. HOLDER
3. MURIAL
4. VINCENT

MURIAL MARRIED RONNIE SUWANAPAL
CHILDREN

1. DONAVAN EDWARD
2. RONNIE JR. BORN 1988

Nowhere on the document do I see mention of the name Thorpe. However, I would add that some times family members, for whatever reason, do not like to admit relationships to celebrities who achieved fame in another locale.

[Robert Braun]

Dr. Chown...

Thanks so very much for sharing this information!

How did you come by correspondence from/with Dr Eby? Is he a collegue? Former professor at NIU?

Regarding your closing comments, I understand from Sue at the Hoard Museum that she checked several family members. While I agree with you that occasionaly some families are reluctant to discose relationships with famous persons in order to avoid the inevitable deluge of the geneologists, academians, and the curious-- I understand from her that this was apparently not the case with the Thorpe descendants and relations.

Again... thanks for your contribution to our discussion. Feel free to stop by often!

Cordially,

Bob Braun
Moderator.

[Jeffrey]

Bob,
Sorry I've been slow to respond to your post, but I was doing some correspondence relevant to your earlier comments about the Thorpe/Black Hawk connection. I've been referred three times now as to who made the original claim about Thorpe/Black Hawk on the NIU web page, and I don't know if I will find the author, as apparently it's a link to a local history group. The most authoritative source for the claim seems to be Sharon Malinowski in an essay "Jim Thorpe" in a volume called "Notable Native Americans" for Gale Research Inc., Detroit, Michigan, in 1995. I haven't looked at the volume yet, but Gale Research is not known for rigorous editorial review.
On another front, I wrote to the Jim Thorpe Home in Yale, Oklahoma about it, and the Manager, Alice Cussner, wrote on December 31, 2003:
"I talked to Gail Thorpe she lives here in Yale, Jim Thorpe's oldest daughter and she said that Jim was not related to Chief Black Hawk they just belonged to the same Thunder clan." I also wrote to Thorpe's other daughter, who does activist internet work, but haven't heard from her yet.
As to the other question, Cecil Eby is a retired University of Michigan professor who lives about two blocks from my parents' house in Ann Arbor. He hasn't thought much about the Black Hawk war in a number of years, as he's now working on a book about the Spanish Civil War.
Jeffrey Chown